No Control is a great album. But suffer was the reason punk rock in so. cal was reborn. That's why its always on the list. Like Green Day Dookie. Green Day had better albums, but dookie, like Suffer, was revolutionary and sparked a movement (albeit green day's movement was mainstream and had already been going on). I'm not putting the two on the same level, so please don't get into a green day discussion. This is a br messageboard. I was just comparing for intents and purposes.

really ?? suffer, i mean its good but No control, against the grain and stranger than fiction are better, suffer has its good moments but some songs feel like filler, but yeah Gun'N'Roses definetly deserve #1, that albulm is pure magic, I mean Welcome to the Jungle is a blend of amazing muscianship and social commentary on life in the underbelly of america, and thats only 1 out of the 12 tracks, but yeah no control should have been on there instead of suffer, in my opinion

oh, i got that reference...and I thought it was quite clever. Actually it was just nice to see someone not respond in a agressive tone to my joke. So thanks for that. And kudos to you being able to take a joke. Seriously...its refreshing.

I had a lot of time to kill in between classes today. Obviously, there wasn't any significance.
However, I'm sure plenty of people understand the Greg Hetson, Blades of Steel reference.

Anthony, I'm not sure if anyone outside of the audience in your drunken head understood what you were talking about. But thanks anyway. (i'm kidding. lets not get bent out of shape everyone.)

Thanks Adam Horner, for this news.

Comments by RatGuy from United States on 2006-11-09 @ 22:57
I wish my pizza was emo so it could cut itself
---------
only comment that counted. EVER.
PLEASE!!! keep submitting lists over and over again to piss the 'list haters' off... and while you're at it just keep on mentioning the Greg Graffin webcam incident to piss EVERYONE off. And while you're at that, start thinking making shit up, like Kurt Cobain and Tupac live in my basement and Rolling Stone magazine just pronounced The Game as the world's # 1 guitarist, shit, I mean Courtney Love... wait no Jay Bentley, just pronounced Henry Rollins as BR's best front man ever, fuck, I meant to say BF... Best Friends?
DEWD!
BR-Space Top 8!
1. Stuffer!
2. No Console!
3. The Gay Race!
4. The Empire Likes Shirts!
5. The Game just kicked 50 Cent's Ass!
6. Greg Graffin just kicked The Game's Ass!
7. Greg Hetson Loves Blades of Steel DEWD! (It's a Hockey Game)
8. I just took a piss on American Football!!

Honestly Automatic Henchman, I really didn't think so. It was almost like they only raised the volume of the entire cd instead of making everything sound clearer. Thats just my opinion though and I could be wrong.

All BR albums has its own special sound/production thats part of its uniqueness. In my opinion theres just two or three albums that have a really great sound with The Process of Belief as the absolutely best. New America deserve a better sound. Question: Are How could hell... or Against the grain worth buying in new remastered versions?

Spork, you're a fucking idiot if you mean to degrade kurt Cobain's contribution to music! He was the last great songwriter since John Lennon. He was the death rattle of true artists in the music industry.
Greg Graffin and co. won't get the recognition they deserve because they're pure fucking PUNK ROCK! THEY ARE NOT MAINSTREAM MUSIC!!! Us fans know how fucking important they are, why sould we care if some buttplugs a Kerrang think they're great? Punk is not about acceptance, it's about individualism!!! Do you people want to see them on MTV? then quit fucking bitching!!! I'm sure it doesn't matter to them where they are so don't let it bother you.
personally, my top five would be:
1. Against the Grain
2. Generator
3. No Control
4. Suffer
5. The Grey Race

He sounds kind of passionless to me...The way he sounds on Palladium is a lot more accurate. I don't know even maybe he was just burnt out on touring at that point, but he just didn't sing with that same flair. Thats why I was really hoping Palladium would come with a companion live cd.

Well people are definitely of different opinions on the way Tested sounded. From the reviews I've read people either really love it, or really hate it. In my own opinion it sounds slow and Greg's voice sounds old and run down. But that's just me.

the end result, the album itself, sounds like crap.
I love the way Tested sounded, especially Operation Rescue.
It sounded so raw and awesome!

Great point Banjo, but I don't think that's what affected TGR. The overdubbing is what killed it. There's plenty of great albums (from tons of other bands) that were recorded with the band doing the songs all at once. The overproduction on Grey Race made the album sound kind of generic and way too hi-fi. I guess I'm just not cool like that.
And Rat Guy, that was a great example. i was so stoked about tested when I heard about HOW it was recorded. But it ended up just being a bad idea. It made me realize I do like hearing the crowd on live cd's.

Having read "The Answer" on the topic of the Gray Race album, it seems your information is correct, Banjo. The energy is definitely there. Also written is the fact that they changed the sound of Bobby's drums:
"He (Greg Graffin) emphasized the fact that the trademark click pedal drumming is more subdued in The Gray Race than on previous Epitaph recordings."
The idea sounds good in theory, but the end result in my opinion isn't great. Just like their whole theory on recording Tested. It sounds great on paper as a theory, but the end result, the album itself, sounds like crap. In fact if I had heard Tested before seeing them live, I probably would not have gone to see them. But that's a different topic altogether.

Comments by RatGuy from United States on 2006-11-16 @ 15:35
The Gray Race is indeed Greg at his vocal best, but the production bothers me. I'm not quite sure why, something to do with the drums, they sound like they're electric, the whole production too clean for a punk album.
The Gray Race was unlike most of their albums (Aside from HCHBAW?) as it was recorded live in the studio, iirc.

Right on Rat Guy. I actually didn't really dig Gray Race at first because of the production issues. It really sucks too, because that's the only greg album w/o brett that got any praise (even to the slightest degree) from critics and fans alike. I love it though, but ya know I love NS and TNA, so i'm not exactly a good objective BR judge. STF might have been even better if they would have put News from the front and Mediocrity in my humble opinion.
And right on again about No Control's lyrics. I Want Something More is quite amazing. What also comes to mind trying to sing along with is The World Won't Stop and Sometimes I Feel Like... Those are two I'd love to hear live. Imagine Brooks playing "Sometimes I feel like" he'd rip it up!
HOw about this everyone. Top 5 BR covers. If anyone cares, I'd say
1.Process
2.Suffer
3.Empire
4.No Substance- or maybe its just the pics throughout
5.How Could Hell...or the single for NA with the kids holding the guns saying the pledge.
Comments?

Stranger Than Fiction would have been an awesome album if it hadn't been for the shit production. The same goes for New America.
Both those albums have some top-quality BR songs, but they were let down by the poor standard production.
I mean, I know a 'punk' album shouldn't be polished, but when it just sounds awful, then maybe it's time to question that a litte? :S

The Gray Race is indeed Greg at his vocal best, but the production bothers me. I'm not quite sure why, something to do with the drums, they sound like they're electric, the whole production too clean for a punk album.
Danny, your Top 5 is closest to mine for the same reasons, except I'd put No Control right above Suffer, just because the songs are lyrically the most unique (ever try singing along to I Want Something More?), and is everything I believe a punk album should be; raw, angry, and fast.

Rat Guy, I wasn't trying to do that. Thanks for remembering me though. My reputation precedes me. All I was saying is that BR is obviously awesome, but the world continues to turn with or without them. Most of the top 5 bands that would make it wouldn't include any that cite BR as an influence. Even if Green Day were to make the list, BR didn't influence them in the least. My personal top 5 from BR:
1. Process Of Belief - at their best musically and lyrically
2.STF - Sonically the band at their peak
3. Recipe For Hate - showing their diversity
4. Suffer - saved punk rock. nuff said
5. Grey Race - expect the comment. But was Graffin's voice ever stronger. His voice is absolutely amazing here.

By the way no BR albums are shit. Stop swearing in the Bad Religion - church.

I guess you didn't understand my stoked humor (Or bad humor or whatever).

Comments by Automatic henchman from Norway on 2006-11-08 @ 18:49
Why don't they appear with all their 13 albums on the top 13?
--------
Because some BR albums are shit!

Those lists are mostly arbitrary ; they actually try to satisfy as many people as possible... I remember reading the Rolling Stone's magazine top 100 guitarist of all times : Kurt Cobain was number 13...

br will never be a critics band. top 100 lists are arbitrary. there are no facts regarding what band/album is better than another. its all ridiculous. against hte grain is the greatest album of all time in my opinion. that wont be make any mainstream critics top 1000. who cares.

The Top 5 for the BR infected
1. Suffer
2. How Could Hell
3. Stranger than Fiction
4. Empire Strike First
5. Grey Race

um.. minor threat and black flag were in that list aswell.

the featured tracks were how much is enough forbidden beat and delirium of disorder but not suffer

um.. minor threat and black flag were in that list aswell.

Yeah, stop moaning about BR not being on the top. As much as I love BR I have to say that there are bands/artists that are a lot more important and there are so many great albums. I'm pretty sure that The Beatles are somewhere in the top.
gimme a god damn break. and yeah i'm gonna bitch and moan that br didnt have more albums on some stupid list. its a list..everybody wants to be on a list..duh
seriously i dont give a flying shit if some lame ass dude who couldnt make it as a musican, professionally is gonna make a list every year and proclaim that kurt cobain saved the music industry. HES DEAD!!!!!
we all know br doesnt get enough props for being a great band PERIOD.
shut the fuck up global citizen.

Fuck it.... my top five
1. Nintendo Wii- Richard Dawkins/Miss Garrison
2. Dildo's on Ice- Greg Graffin
3. Evolution IS a crime- Nintendo Wii
4. No Control
5. Suffer
SHIT! Sorry guys. BR didn't make my top 3 either. Well, when I first commented they did, but I gave it some thought and, well, all this commotion seemed to have Struck A Nerve... later poopstains.
P.S. now, someone please comment on how immature I am. Please.

The REAL top 5 in Kerrang was something along the lines of:
1. Guns n Roses - Appetite For Destruction.
2. Metallica
3. AC/DC
4. Led Zeppelin
5. Black Sabbath
I can't remember the album names, but I seem to remember those being the top 5.

Haha!

I wish my pizza was emo so it could cut itself

Kerrang is an emo-rag anyways.
It used to be alright, but now it just panders to the latest fashion, which is emo. Pathetic.
And I don't think it matters if we want to put BR at the top or not; music is really subjective, and so no one really has the final word.
I mean, I reckon Suffer is overrated sometimes.

1: The Skies Above - The Black Mages
2: The Wall - Pink Floyd
3: The Court of the Crimson King - King Crimson
4: Dark Side of the Moon - Pink Floyd
5: Generator - Bad Religion
in my opinion, of course.

i beg to differ
1. The Empires Srikes First
2. The Process Of Belief
3. Against The Grain
4. The Gray Race
5. Stranger Than Fiction

Yeah, stop moaning about BR not being on the top. As much as I love BR I have to say that there are bands/artists that are a lot more important and there are so many great albums. I'm pretty sure that The Beatles are somewhere in the top.

yeah thats pretty badass they got on the listing at all... but heres my top 5 as if anyone is interested
1. AGAINST THE FUCKIN GRAIN
2. Suffer
3. No Control
(what a surprise that those 3 made the top 3 slots)
4. Tested - can i include that one please?
5. The Gray Race

Come on Danny, it's all in good fun. Come Join Us and just put in your Top 5. Unless you're trying to rile up someone specific...

Well, congrats to BR. But I think hte top 3 or 4 went like this:
1. London Calling - Clash
2. Nevermind - Nirvana
3. Dookie - Green Day
4. Ten - Pearl Jam
But I'm not sure.

Why can't you all just be happy that BR got some goddamn recognition at least. We have to bitch and moan about everything. And clearly us die hard BR fans can't even agree on an exact order of their 5, yet we think that all of the catalog should be on the top 13. BR rules guys, but get off your phlegmatic asses. There are plenty of other great (possibly better) albums out there by other bands. I can just hear it now..."Ah...blasphemy. And you call yourself a BR fan?" Come with the inane arguments as to why BR's 13 albums are the best ever. I'm ready.

Don't tell me...let me guess..
1. Metallica - Metallica
2. Nirvana - Nevermind
3. Green Day - Dookie
4. Soundgarden - Superunknown
etc etc

Can we please get a scan?

I'm surprised, actually, Bad Religion, one would think, would earn a more credible spot on any list that would even consider nominating them for their music. It's shameful... however, the list should appear as so:
1. No Control
2. Suffer
3. How Could Hell...
4. Recipe For Hate
5 Any other, they're all geeewwwd.

It should be this way
1.Suffer
2.Recipe For Hate
3.Generator
4.No Control
5.The Process Of Belief

Why don't they appear with all their 13 albums on the top 13?