now i have read all of this, and i have nothing to say.

Touch

Me thinks Boltzzman and I are done for now, but like any good saga: stay tuned.
Despite our debating, however, I've never claimed to have The Answer, I continue to Give You Nothing, and I clearly have No Direction with this Voracious March Of Godliness that I'm involved in. But I well know my Drastic Actions will only contribute to The New America - which has No Substance, the markings of The Grey Race and is Striking First at Supersonic speeds. But it is now time i Walk Away because what we clearly need is a Change of Ideas. I'm ashamed of Who We Are because despite the News From the Front, we are only marching further into Mediocrity, Misery and Famine and contributing more to The Dichotomy...we are going the Way Of The Dodo my friends. But Billy Gnosis, The Queen Of The 21st Century and "Tommy" are calling me over. Perhaps You can drop a card or letter to my side of town one day, but I'm sure we'll be seeing eachother once more on the path Along The Way...
watch out announcer....

"A good sense of humor can diffuse any powderkeg." Drunk Sincerity from a Man With A Mission who definitely Struck a Nerve. You've Got a Chance to Come Join Us when Boltzzman and Danny Holloway return to our currently scheduled programming, "The Christian Cover of Sorrow" and take over the forum with witty banter. Join Them and Us here on The Bad Religion Page as nobody Listens to their Empty Causes on this mammoth pogrom set upon us courtesy of the U.S.A. called the internet.

Bravo my friend. A good sense of humor can diffuse any powderkeg.

That was actually a fantastic BR allusion by the way "announcer"

I love how I'm apparently known for having the last word....(applause)
I'd like to that the academy...
Boltzzman for his "in your face intellect"
Myself for my "don't take shit attitude"
And the announcer for being a great black and white voice over.
I can only hope boltzzman hasn't left the building...(add your comment here my 'friendly fire friend')

And that about wraps it up for today's episode of "Passions for BR". Today's episode brought to you by "The Bad Religion Page... bringing you 1000 More Fools who are Bored and Extremely Dangerous"
And now a final word by Boltzzman... and perhaps Danny Holloway.

Bad Religon tries to bring us together, but in our world today it's very difficult. The problem with our current societal climate is that intense individualism has become a kind of RELIGION. People nowadays are so focused on doing what's best for themselves (or there specific sub-group) that they forget that we are all part of a global collective. I'm not knocking individualism. I'm just saying that it causes a good number of people to lose sight of the big picture. Bad Religon's music is full of these sort of statements. Unfortunately, a good number of Bad Religion fans can't see the forest for the trees. Hopefully Bad Religion's music will open some of our eyes. Unfortunately, some people will only see the world that is right in front of their nose. Republicans, Democrats, Christians, Muslims, etc. These are all groups who claim to have the answers. Until we are able to think more abstractly about our world we are doomed to devisiveness. Sorry for the manifesto, but that's how it is.

not even bad religion can bring this divided world together anymore...

I never said you didn't. However, your statement (by your own admission) was based on absolutely nothing. If you'd like to be known as the type of person who speaks without thinking or reading what the topic is than by all means continue to spout nonsense. If you'd like to make an informed comment, however, perhaps you should take on the arduous task of actually reading what it is your commenting on. Whether anyone cares what you have to say, or not, at least you don't sound like a reactionary fool (I'm not calling you names, relax).

I have a right to speak my mind!!! so..... ummm.... fuck you!!

you're suck a a-hole dude. i mean that in a nice way. my ignorance about the color...or lack thereof

Didn't Finland just celebrate independence day? Please keep your uninformed comments away from our independent conversation. Thank you.

Hello! Im too tired to read what you guys have written, but shut up already

"Like Sands through the hourglass, so are the days of our lives..."
I'm happy to hear that. Again, I agree that the album was very influential, I just don't think it's great. On a personal note, I enjoy discussions, not arguments. When we start taking everything so personally that's when the annoying ten page long fights break out. I try to keep my criticisms directed towards ideas, not people. Sometimes I'll jokingly poke fun for irony's sake, but not to be an asshole. Let's just agree to keep our criticisms about ideas, not each others character. Peace.
By the way, Black is not "a dark color". Black is the absence of all color.
Wanna Fight? Just kidding...

Will Boltzzman accept Danny's olive branch and agree to disagree? Or will he spit in Danny's face while arguing his way to the top? Stay tuned til next time right here on "Passions for BR"!

Boltzzman, I've had many conversations with you and I like you just fine. I'm not trying to argue with you. I was just stating my point of view buddy. No hostility on my part. I realize you and I can't even agree that the color black is a dark color, but I'm not trying to pick a fight with you. I simply think that in Dookie is alot more credible than you think. I grew up in S. Texas. Most people outside of Cali would never have heard of punk in the early 90s if it weren't for GD, that's all I'm saying buddy. Much love though. Most liberals and democrats live divided. The last thing we need is for BR fans the be of the same! lol.

Why are you arguing with me? You're agreeing with me. I said that a compelling argument could made that it is one of the most INFLUENTIAL albums. It's not one of the BEST. Period. Per usual you're reacting to something other than what I said.
As for punk rock not being near a 10 or 11 year old? You must have led a pretty sheltered life. I don't know where you live, but when I was in High School, in the early 90's, I heard punk on the radio all the time...before Green Day. Bad Religon, early NOFX, Dead Kennedy's, the list goes on and on. Without the build-up of bands like this there would be no Green Day. I understand not everyone had the same experiences, but Dookie could have been almost any album. It was in the right place at the right time, that's all.
And finally, I said "In my Opinion". I didn't say anything negative about you or anyone else. I said "It" was sad. Many of you are annoyed with me for starting these arguments. I think you need to take a look at yourselves first.

who cares, we're all now better than dookie ever was so >:o.

And your comparison was way off. The Shakespeare thing is just ridiculous. Are people who were ignorant to punk rock before the age of 10 supposed to feel embarrased for that? Before 1994 punk rock wouldn't have made it anywhere near a 10 or 11 year old unless they had an older sibling, cousin or friend showing them the way.

How old are you Boltzzman? For most 20somethings Dookie was the first exposure to punk rock we had. I was 10 or 11 when it came out. Before that, you didn't hear punk on the radio. If you're 19 or younger, yeah Dookie had no bearing on your gateway to punk. but for most older people, that is simply the case. Plus, did you watch Live at the Palladium. BR may have never jumped to a major label if not for dookie and offspring's smash to make it so marketable. For that reason it should be on the top 10. It caused a mainstream music wave that made many people look into underground punk who may not have done so otherwise.

It makes me sad to hear that most of you were exposed to punk because of Dookie. It's sort of like saying "I was exposed to Shakespeare because I watched the Leonardo DiCaprio version of Romeo and Juliet." I realize it was a popular album that did cause people to take notice. It was also, in my opinion, one step below the Bee-Gees remake of "Sgt. Peppers" when it comes to the best albums of all time! It may have caused some people to migrate towards a style of music that they had not previously been exposed to, but the album itself is pretty pedestrian and does not deserve to be on a list of the BEST ALBUMS. Now a list of MOST INFLUENTIAL ALBUMS...that's another story.

Good point Danny Holloway

how come everyone thinks dks fresh fruit is there best? Ive always thought plastic surgery disasters was better

Its so cool and punk to complain how dookie is up on the list...especially since most of us wouldn't have been so exposed to punk if it wasn't for GD.

Wow...I'm surprised they acknowledged Crass on there, considering that its a list with Dookie being higher up than Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables. Not to mention the low ratings for Suffer and Static Age, both great albums by great bands.

Shit... none of it matters. There's no reason to get upset, truly. It's obvious that those who came up with the list have major misconceptions about punk rock and its history. To get upset about it is just like getting pissed off at your tv when someone calls in and says something ridiculously ignorant on C-SPAN... there's no point. I think it's rather commical that the people who wrote up that damn list probably still have jobs, considering they would even think to put bands like Blink 182 and Offspring on such a list. I'll bet the Dead Boys or Slaughter and The Dogs aren't even on the list, just to name a couple. Read Loud, Fast, Rules... it's still lame but has a much more credible staff.

Suffer is better that ATG. There's more anger and aggression in Greg's voice, Pete's drum timing was never better, and its more stripped down...which is more punk. ATG is great, but one of their more monotone epitaph releases.

And WTF at Bosstones being on there...Bosstones = Hardcore Ska, it was never punk rock

It's number 37?!?! OMG Clerks'd!! BTW Kerrang = Tiger Beat IMO

Kerrang has always been crappy. You can't take a magazine seriously that even consider to put records by bands like Offspring, Blink 182, Exploited on a Best punk albums list. This list just feels like an insult to the wonderful world of punk rock. And not putting X - Los Angeles there at all is just weird...

Blink 182 ahead of Minor Threat? Two Offspring albums ahead of Cro-Mags? Sex Pistols number 1? Kinda funny.

BR albums better than Suffer:
Almost all of them.
C'mon, how can anyone say Suffer is better than Against the Grain??

we get upset because Offspring-Americana, was ranked ahead of suffer.

maybe this is your first time here tommy...we get upset about everything.

This list is just some opinion of a few people. We all have a different opinion. I think the new america has some important punklyrics, especially "a streetkid named desire". But 99% of the people will disagree with me. anyway Don't get angry over a stupid list.

this isn't news! this is crap!! blink 182??? what the fuck?? offspring?? sex pistols is number 1??? why?? somebody kill me please

I submitted it as well!
Plus I don't choose what makes the news, I'm just a regular submitter @_@

There are bands on there that have absolutely no place on any list. Why is The Getup Kids on there? Tell me please.

Seriously.. Recipe for hate deserves to be on the list because of it's uniqueness. It represents a direction in punkrock

Fuck! my bad ratguy. After reading your statement again, i sewe you were agreeing with me...Talk about heeding my own advice. I have a hangover...please don't judge. Sorry about that. I'll eat crow in a very public forum.

RatGuy, reread my comment. I never stated that Dookie should have been higher than suffer. "Don't mind GD being on there twice, just Suffer and Process should be ahead of it." I realize the fact that you state very much. You don't need to tell me what's what. Just read my statement carefully

Neil is a sonuvabitch! I was the one whoe submitted this and he is taking credit. Where's your ethics motherfucker!

My thoughts exactly, Danny. Green Day's Dookie was a great catalyst for mainstream punk, but would be nowhere without Bad Religion's Suffer, which actuallu started a new era of punk from which Green Day became a part of.

This is a list Kerrang publised in a punk special about 5 or 6 years ago. Notice there's no albums released after 2000.

at least nofx were in there twice

Saw this yesterday. Just bullshit. Blink 182 is ahead of Black Flag. Offspring at NO. 5. Green Day's Nimrod also on the list. Don't mind GD being on there twice, just Suffer and Process should be ahead of it. )Also American Idiot should be on there instead of Nimrod). Oh well. These lists are always purely subjective and hardly creditable journalism.
Well