therightclique
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
at least 80% of the reason you waved your credentials was to prove you were better than someone else. that's not very cool. and there ARE too many idiots at good schools to use that as of your knowledge. saying you disagree is one thing. you're also insinuating that a self taught person couldn't possibly know as much a person from your fine school, which is just ridiculous. anyway, at least "we're only gonna die" is definitely not down 2 semitones. i agree that the speed may change over the course of the set, so that would explain the situation with the subsequent songs, but on THAT particular song, 2 semitones is considerably too much. it may be between, as other have stated though. all i know is that his voice sounded accurate at -1 and if i tuned my guitar half step down and played the normal chords (355-577) from the album version, it was near dead on. and when i went down to -2 his voice was too low and unnatural.
03/07/2005 at 11:55
at least 80% of the reason you waved your credentials was to prove you were better than someone else. that's not very cool. and there ARE too many idiots at good schools to use that as of your knowledge. saying you disagree is one thing. you're also insinuating that a self taught person couldn't possibly know as much a person from your fine school, which is just ridiculous. anyway, at least "we're only gonna die" is definitely not down 2 semitones. i agree that the speed may change over the course of the set, so that would explain the situation with the subsequent songs, but on THAT particular song, 2 semitones is considerably too much. it may be between, as other have stated though. all i know is that his voice sounded accurate at -1 and if i tuned my guitar half step down and played the normal chords (355-577) from the album version, it was near dead on. and when i went down to -2 his voice was too low and unnatural.
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
I just think the speed of the record player that was used to record this was off a little. I don't think that anyone purposly raised the pitch. That is why I mentioned the fine tuning. If any of you have Nero 6, you should have Nero Wave Editor. Try it out and let me know what you think. Either that, or D/L my "TEST" torrent file and let me know what you think about the edited copy I made. I was thinking that, if two obviously intellegent music enthusaists are arguing between 1 and 2, maybe it's more like 1.5.
03/06/2005 at 22:35
I just think the speed of the record player that was used to record this was off a little. I don't think that anyone purposly raised the pitch. That is why I mentioned the fine tuning. If any of you have Nero 6, you should have Nero Wave Editor. Try it out and let me know what you think. Either that, or D/L my "TEST" torrent file and let me know what you think about the edited copy I made. I was thinking that, if two obviously intellegent music enthusaists are arguing between 1 and 2, maybe it's more like 1.5.
|
Adam Ragusea
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: Global Citizen |
Sigh. The fact that I hold a degree from an accredited school of music within an american university DOES in fact prove that, barring my having sustained some form of head trauma, I know the names of intervals (which if you'll recall is what was initially in dispute ["You're not understanding what tuning half step down means apparently"]). Of course educational credentials don't necessarily prove a certain level of knowledge or ability, but they are a pretty good indication of them. That's why expert witnesses are asked about their credentials before testifying in court. So think I?m a jackass all you like, just transpose the bootleg correctly. I think the average intonation is about 2 semitones too high, but I admit the possibility that it might be a hair less.
03/06/2005 at 22:07
Sigh. The fact that I hold a degree from an accredited school of music within an american university DOES in fact prove that, barring my having sustained some form of head trauma, I know the names of intervals (which if you'll recall is what was initially in dispute ["You're not understanding what tuning half step down means apparently"]). Of course educational credentials don't necessarily prove a certain level of knowledge or ability, but they are a pretty good indication of them. That's why expert witnesses are asked about their credentials before testifying in court. So think I?m a jackass all you like, just transpose the bootleg correctly. I think the average intonation is about 2 semitones too high, but I admit the possibility that it might be a hair less.
|
therightclique
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
the problem with the credential waving is that it proves nothing.. there are tons of morons at tons of fine schools, so it just makes you sound like a jackass.. and gives people what may be an inaccurate impression of you.
03/06/2005 at 13:23
the problem with the credential waving is that it proves nothing.. there are tons of morons at tons of fine schools, so it just makes you sound like a jackass.. and gives people what may be an inaccurate impression of you.
|
Adam Ragusea
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: Global Citizen |
Repsonce to GuitarGuy part 3: But I honestly don't know. I only retuned one song to minus 2 halfsteps, and greg's voice sounded fine, similar to how it does in the that bootleg from the Back to the Known era (sorry, don't remember what it's called, but i remember that it's available on video, and that Hetson's guitar kept phasing in and out). We have to remember that Greg's voice was changing rapidly around this time, and it may sound deeper here than it does on the original Into the Unknown record.
BUT, let's also keep in mind that the intonation might not be stable on the whole bootleg. The problem in speed may have originally occurred with a busted tape speed regulator that was speeding up and slowing down at random. I haven't listened to it closely enough to figure that out.
Sorry for the mad credential waving at the beginning of this, not looking to start a flame war, just responding in kind to the snarky attitude.
03/06/2005 at 09:08
Repsonce to GuitarGuy part 3: But I honestly don't know. I only retuned one song to minus 2 halfsteps, and greg's voice sounded fine, similar to how it does in the that bootleg from the Back to the Known era (sorry, don't remember what it's called, but i remember that it's available on video, and that Hetson's guitar kept phasing in and out). We have to remember that Greg's voice was changing rapidly around this time, and it may sound deeper here than it does on the original Into the Unknown record.
BUT, let's also keep in mind that the intonation might not be stable on the whole bootleg. The problem in speed may have originally occurred with a busted tape speed regulator that was speeding up and slowing down at random. I haven't listened to it closely enough to figure that out. Sorry for the mad credential waving at the beginning of this, not looking to start a flame war, just responding in kind to the snarky attitude. |
Adam Ragusea
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: Global Citizen |
Responce to GuitarGuy Part 2: Since that transposition obviously goes waaaay too far down, we can presume that they were not playing tuned down a halfstep. THEREFORE, either the bootleg is paced a wholestep too high, OR, they played that concert with the instruments tuned UP a bit, which IS a possibly, but not one that?s terribly likely beyond 40 or 50 cents max. So Justin, you may be right about it being a semitone plus a quartertone (1.5), who knows. When bands play shows, they often just tune from one of the guitars rather than some other more stable source of intonation (like a pitch pipe or a tuning fork or an electronic tuner). If Brett's guitar had gotten knocked up a quarterstep or so before they played the show, then nobody would have been the wiser.
03/06/2005 at 09:07
Responce to GuitarGuy Part 2: Since that transposition obviously goes waaaay too far down, we can presume that they were not playing tuned down a halfstep. THEREFORE, either the bootleg is paced a wholestep too high, OR, they played that concert with the instruments tuned UP a bit, which IS a possibly, but not one that?s terribly likely beyond 40 or 50 cents max. So Justin, you may be right about it being a semitone plus a quartertone (1.5), who knows. When bands play shows, they often just tune from one of the guitars rather than some other more stable source of intonation (like a pitch pipe or a tuning fork or an electronic tuner). If Brett's guitar had gotten knocked up a quarterstep or so before they played the show, then nobody would have been the wiser.
|
Adam Ragusea
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: Global Citizen |
Responce to GuitarGuy Part 1: I'm a graduate student in music composition at one of the top three programs in the States, and I have several years experience of teaching music theory and aural skills at university; I?m no Mahler, but I know what a semitone is.
Let me try to explain this using The Dichotomy as an example. It's probably the best song on the bootleg from which to judge tuning, because it HAS to be played at the open pitch level of the lowest string, otherwise it's not playable. On Into the Unknown, The Dichotomy is in E minor, no? On the bootleg, the song is in F# minor. IF they were playing tuned a half step down, the song would have to sound in Eb (again, because the guitar writing depends on an open bottom string sounding the tonic). Therefore, IF they were playing tuned down a half step, you would have to tune the recording down 3 semitones to get there.
03/06/2005 at 09:05
Responce to GuitarGuy Part 1: I'm a graduate student in music composition at one of the top three programs in the States, and I have several years experience of teaching music theory and aural skills at university; I?m no Mahler, but I know what a semitone is.
Let me try to explain this using The Dichotomy as an example. It's probably the best song on the bootleg from which to judge tuning, because it HAS to be played at the open pitch level of the lowest string, otherwise it's not playable. On Into the Unknown, The Dichotomy is in E minor, no? On the bootleg, the song is in F# minor. IF they were playing tuned a half step down, the song would have to sound in Eb (again, because the guitar writing depends on an open bottom string sounding the tonic). Therefore, IF they were playing tuned down a half step, you would have to tune the recording down 3 semitones to get there. |
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
You will also have to take out the spaces in the url, just like the one therightclique posted earlier.
03/06/2005 at 06:25
You will also have to take out the spaces in the url, just like the one therightclique posted earlier.
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
http:// www.demonoid.com/ torrents/ download/ HTTP/71448/ BadReligionpitchadjustmenttest .www.Demonoid.com.torrent
03/06/2005 at 06:23
http:// www.demonoid.com/ torrents/ download/ HTTP/71448/ BadReligionpitchadjustmenttest .www.Demonoid.com.torrent
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
Hey, sorry I've been busy trying to figure this out. Actually, from what I can tell, it seems to be about -1.5. I found out that with Nero Wave Editor, I can fine tune it. Down to the hundredth of a semitone. I will upload a torrent in a moment for you all to check out.
03/06/2005 at 05:14
Hey, sorry I've been busy trying to figure this out. Actually, from what I can tell, it seems to be about -1.5. I found out that with Nero Wave Editor, I can fine tune it. Down to the hundredth of a semitone. I will upload a torrent in a moment for you all to check out.
|
therightclique
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
i don't know anything about that, but going down two semitones sounds completely wrong. greg's voice is way too low for that period.
03/05/2005 at 21:37
i don't know anything about that, but going down two semitones sounds completely wrong. greg's voice is way too low for that period.
|
GuitarGuy
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United Kingdom |
Adam. You're not understanding what tuning half step down means apparently. I even tested it on my own guitar. If you tune half step down and play 3-5-5 to 5-7-7 you get exactly what that song sounds like if set it down one semitone. think about it. i tested it completely. if you do two semitones, its waaaay too much..
03/05/2005 at 21:35
Adam. You're not understanding what tuning half step down means apparently. I even tested it on my own guitar. If you tune half step down and play 3-5-5 to 5-7-7 you get exactly what that song sounds like if set it down one semitone. think about it. i tested it completely. if you do two semitones, its waaaay too much..
|
Adam Ragysea
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
Ok, no, it's definitely two semitones. By your logic "yeah," they would have to be playing tuned one half step UP for it to work out the way you're thinking, which they would never do. Trust me, it's two semitones. For most of BR's career, they've played all of their shows with the guitars tuned down one half step, but not so in the early days.
So anyways, if someone out there beats me to transposing these, please remember that they also need to be time re-scaled. Most programs that can transpose audio will have a box you can check that says something like "rescale?"
03/05/2005 at 16:07
Ok, no, it's definitely two semitones. By your logic "yeah," they would have to be playing tuned one half step UP for it to work out the way you're thinking, which they would never do. Trust me, it's two semitones. For most of BR's career, they've played all of their shows with the guitars tuned down one half step, but not so in the early days.
So anyways, if someone out there beats me to transposing these, please remember that they also need to be time re-scaled. Most programs that can transpose audio will have a box you can check that says something like "rescale?" |
therightclique
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
hey, i uploaded only gonna die.. its been re-encoded to be -1 semitone, which appears to be the right key... go to "http://icegoat.com/ therightclique/ upload/ onlygonnadie.mp3" to check it out. take out the spaces in the URL. this thing won't let you type long words for some reason. if you guys think it sounds right, i can email whoever's in charge with all of the tracks, unless somebody beats me to it.
03/05/2005 at 13:05
hey, i uploaded only gonna die.. its been re-encoded to be -1 semitone, which appears to be the right key... go to "http://icegoat.com/ therightclique/ upload/ onlygonnadie.mp3" to check it out. take out the spaces in the URL. this thing won't let you type long words for some reason. if you guys think it sounds right, i can email whoever's in charge with all of the tracks, unless somebody beats me to it.
|
yeah
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
i may have spoken pre-maturely.. i'm gonna play around with it a little more and see if i can nail down a method.
03/05/2005 at 12:13
i may have spoken pre-maturely.. i'm gonna play around with it a little more and see if i can nail down a method.
|
yeah
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
i was just playing around with part iii in cool edit and i did a resample down 1 semitone and even though its not in key with the album, greg's voice sounds the most accurate.. also, i believe they are simply playing tuned a half step down, which would explain why the other guy thought it should be 2 semitones down. but if you go down 2, greg's voice sounds too low, but it sounds dead on with just -1... i'd be more than willing to re-encode all of these songs, but i don't have any expertice in doing torrents.
03/05/2005 at 12:07
i was just playing around with part iii in cool edit and i did a resample down 1 semitone and even though its not in key with the album, greg's voice sounds the most accurate.. also, i believe they are simply playing tuned a half step down, which would explain why the other guy thought it should be 2 semitones down. but if you go down 2, greg's voice sounds too low, but it sounds dead on with just -1... i'd be more than willing to re-encode all of these songs, but i don't have any expertice in doing torrents.
|
yeah
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
also, for those like me that didn't know, a semitone is exactly one half step.
03/05/2005 at 11:58
also, for those like me that didn't know, a semitone is exactly one half step.
|
yeah
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
played along with fuck armageddon too and its not perfectly in key when played a whole step up, but its very close.
03/05/2005 at 11:58
played along with fuck armageddon too and its not perfectly in key when played a whole step up, but its very close.
|
Yeah
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
well, i just played guitar along with we're only gonna die.. the album version starts with G->A and this version is A->B. its perfectly in key with that though.. so it appears to be a whole step above the album.. i'm not sure what that equates to in semitones. so, assuming they were playing in the key the album was recorded on (which is an iffy assumption since they don't play american jesus in the same key live) we can just lower the whole set by one whole step exactly and it should sound exactly the way it was meant to.
03/05/2005 at 11:56
well, i just played guitar along with we're only gonna die.. the album version starts with G->A and this version is A->B. its perfectly in key with that though.. so it appears to be a whole step above the album.. i'm not sure what that equates to in semitones. so, assuming they were playing in the key the album was recorded on (which is an iffy assumption since they don't play american jesus in the same key live) we can just lower the whole set by one whole step exactly and it should sound exactly the way it was meant to.
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
Actually, I have Nero 6 Reloaded. It comes with a sound editor. Only one thing, on there it seemed more like 3 or 4 semitones. I could be wrong. What I may do is make a torrent and do the same somg three or four different ways, let you all decide which one sounds best then edit the whole album accordingly.
03/03/2005 at 16:21
Actually, I have Nero 6 Reloaded. It comes with a sound editor. Only one thing, on there it seemed more like 3 or 4 semitones. I could be wrong. What I may do is make a torrent and do the same somg three or four different ways, let you all decide which one sounds best then edit the whole album accordingly.
|
tommy
Lost Pilgrim
![]() ![]() Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Posts: 37 |
A lot of intel computers with an advance card have this program on it called "sound effect manager" with that program you can pitch any windows sound
03/02/2005 at 17:03
A lot of intel computers with an advance card have this program on it called "sound effect manager" with that program you can pitch any windows sound
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
I am quite interested in hearing what it's supposed to sound like. I haven't got into tone editing yet, if that's what you even call it, or I would do it myself. I think I have some software that will fix it, I'll have to check.
03/02/2005 at 07:31
I am quite interested in hearing what it's supposed to sound like. I haven't got into tone editing yet, if that's what you even call it, or I would do it myself. I think I have some software that will fix it, I'll have to check.
|
tommy
Lost Pilgrim
![]() ![]() Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Posts: 37 |
oh and I'm happy with 128k/bit quality, t sounds okay, and then everybody can download it faster
03/01/2005 at 01:32
oh and I'm happy with 128k/bit quality, t sounds okay, and then everybody can download it faster
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
Please let me know when you do. I will take down this copy and post the one that you fixed. Also, I will definately give you credit for your work. I would really appreciate the help. Thank you.
02/28/2005 at 17:19
Please let me know when you do. I will take down this copy and post the one that you fixed. Also, I will definately give you credit for your work. I would really appreciate the help. Thank you.
|
Adam Ragusea
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: Global Citizen |
No, Greg is not on helium. At some point, probably in the vinyl mastering stage, this record got sped up by about two semitones. I just used the phase vocoding function of Soundhack to correct this mistake and get "It's Only Over When" back down to the correct speed. Greg sounds like Greg again. When I get some time, I'll try to correct the speed on the whole bootleg, and then maybe that can get offered for download here.
02/28/2005 at 11:02
No, Greg is not on helium. At some point, probably in the vinyl mastering stage, this record got sped up by about two semitones. I just used the phase vocoding function of Soundhack to correct this mistake and get "It's Only Over When" back down to the correct speed. Greg sounds like Greg again. When I get some time, I'll try to correct the speed on the whole bootleg, and then maybe that can get offered for download here.
|
RatGuy
Hippy Killer
![]() ![]() Status: Offline Posts: 2 |
Wow. Paul Dedona sucks ass on bass. It's Greg Graffin on helium!
02/28/2005 at 01:45
Wow. Paul Dedona sucks ass on bass. It's Greg Graffin on helium!
|
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
No problem. I hope you all enjoy these.
![]() 02/28/2005 at 01:38
No problem. I hope you all enjoy these.
![]() |
tommy
Lost Pilgrim
![]() ![]() Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Posts: 37 |
THANKS A LOT!!!!!
![]() 02/27/2005 at 21:57
THANKS A LOT!!!!!
![]() |
Justin Paden
Guest
![]() ![]() Location: United States |
I believe that badseednick from The Sharing Club was after this one.
![]() 02/27/2005 at 20:58
I believe that badseednick from The Sharing Club was after this one.
![]() |
Nirvision
Blenderhead
![]() ![]() Location: United States Status: Offline Posts: 55 |
Awesome to the max!
02/27/2005 at 20:26
Awesome to the max!
|