Big Diehl...
if you get KROQ to play 'Honest Goodbye' at 9:00PM tonite, I'll buy your book.

It's nice that someone finally took it upon themselves to examine the cultural rift in punk rock. As far as I can tell, the actual discourse involves the punk "fashion" as well as it's general acceptance by the mainstream. We all have our opinions on this, but hopefully the book will be purely analytical and "bi-partisan," if you will. I may be "old" as far as punk is concerned, but I remember the glory days and I honestly am surprised that punk didn't collapse in on itself as a protest to the first few bands that jumped into the mainstream. I think that says a lot about punk. Either it's got the soul to endure, or it has it's own price. Either way, it still remains in some viable form.

Okay, maybe I got a little too excited and overdid it... I guess there's a reason why each post is limited to 1000 characters! Thanks for enduring...

Matt D. sure likes to write.

stupid f key escaping my grasp again

are you finished? good...er... thanks or all that.

Lastly, totally unrelated to MY SO-CALLED PUNK, I hear the new Bad Brains rules. It was produced by MCA/Beastie Boys, who says he wanted to return the band to their rougher, pre-ROCK FOR LIGHT sound... I love the ROIR tape best, frankly

What was interesting to me was what happened in this transition. Furthermore, love 'em or hate 'em, Simple Plan take elements of their DIY experience and bring them into the mainstream: they book their own tours, control their own merch (which is made by an old punk pal, who may not have had such a good job if they hadn't hired him). That a band like Simple Plan incorporates DIY lessons into their big-corporate attack could be positive (Warped does something similar). The members of Fall Out Boy also came up in the DIY underground, inspired by the legends of neo-punk, playing DIY venues like the Fireside Bowl and many basements/VFW halls, etc. Is it the same as the DIY underground? No. But I would rather Simple Plan bringing some DIY culture into the corporate world than just another boy-band that is strictly a machine creation? But it is a tough call ? it's where the tension to all this debate comes from.

For one, this is not a book about just the DIY underground, which is not neglected: underground bands ARE discussed/interviewed--I'll bet this is the only book out from a major publisher that discusses Horace Pinker! But more than anything, MY SO-CALLED PUNK is about what happened when members of that DIY underground went big business. It's about looking to see if punk was able to save any of its soul in the process. Remember, punk started with major labels (Sex Pistols, Ramones, etc.); again, this is another cultural contradiction/tension I discuss extensively in MY SO-CALLED PUNK. As for Yellowcard, they came from that very "DIY underground" you so revere?booking their own tours, playing basements and dives like the Fireside Bowl. So did?ha ha!?Simple Plan (when they were Reset).

"I'm not sure why Green day are one of 'Neo punks legends' and blink182 are ''mall punk''. Surely those two go under the same catagory."
Well, it may be a matter of taste and ideology. Frankly, I think AMERICAN IDIOT is more musically challenging, politically crucial work of art than anything Blink ever did (although Blink CAN write a hook). Are they both bands who foreswore indie labels for the majors? Yes. Did they probably compromise something in the process? Yes, perhaps. I understand someone hating them for that. But my personal scope is bigger than that. Besides, while I may prefer underground music, I want to take on the whole culture: MY SO-CALLED PUNK attempts to cover the big picture, not just one little "scene." But again, I'm sure everybody will have a different opinion?

Okay, are Bad Religion "neo-punk"? No. However, they are the founding fathers of that generation of punk bands. In fact, I would argue that when Bad Religion reunited and released SUFFER in '88, they jumpstarted the neo-punk scene. Just as Black Flag paved the way for a new generation of punks, creating tour circuits, independent distribution and the like, so did Bad Religion a decade later. Out of Bad Religion's reunion, Epitaph was spawned, resulting in the signing of Pennywise, Rancid, Offspring, etc. As well, there would probably be no NOFX/Fat Wreck without Bad Religion's example. So yes, I discovered Bad Religion over 20 years ago on a BYO comp, but they still provided the spark for new punks everywhere. Also, musically they combined hooks and musicality with punk anger, which has also become a hallmark of neo-punk. Anyways, I (you guessed it) discuss this at length in MY SO-CALLED PUNK

In addition, I was a founding member of Chicago's first Oi! Band, and we did shows with the likes of the Damned and the Exploited. My first punk show was when I was 11, when I saw Johnny Thunders; that same year I saw the Damned, the Bad Brains, and the Dead Kennedys. Did you see the original lineups of the Misfits, Discharge, or the U.K. Subs? Didn't think so; I did. So anyway, I'll put my "punk points" up against anyone?and you know what? Unless you're Johnny fucking Rotten, you'll LOSE. Read the book, and you'll see? I wrote this book because I wanted to explore what happened when punk aesthetics became popular?when those that came from "the scene" went big biz. What happened to the soul of punk then? That's what I wanted to discover in writing MY SO-CALLED PUNK; only you can tell me if I was successful?

1. "what business does some rolling stone, MTV bitch ass have commenting on punk rock."
Have I been on MTV as an "expert"? Yes. Was I a music columnist at ELLE magazine (admittedly not a paragon of punk)? Yes. However, I am a punk OG?surprise, surprise, some punks have to grow up and get a job, and my job is writing; a pretty cool, creative job at that. Anyways, I was in one of Chicago's seminal punk rock bands, Nadsat Rebel, back in the day: our first show was opening for Big Black (Steve Albini recorded our demos) and our second was with Husker Du; after that we played shows with the likes of GBH, Samhain (Danzig's post-Misfits group), Articles of Faith, Effigies, Naked Raygun, and so on. We were also on the classic MIDDLE OF AMERICA compilation, and the LAST RITES: CODE BLUE tape, alongside Husker Du, Naked Raygun, White Flag, Die Kreuzen, Out of Order and so on.

Hey,
Matt Diehl here. I'm the author of MY SO-CALLED PUNK. I love all your comments--nasty and otherwise! That is, of course, truly punk. Anyways, I responded to a lot of these kinds of comments on a similar thread over at punknews.org. I will post a slightly revised version here (that i put in my myspace blog--yes myspace, hate me now), as it definitely addresses your thoughts. And yes, Bad Religion are gods...

Thanks danny...that helped clear the fuzz. And, on second thought, I guess those late shows (which I barely ever watch) have different obscure bands playing all the time.

they did infected on letterman, i remember that.

Does anyone remember seeing br on one of those late shows (Letterman or Leno), performing 21stC? How about that MTV video of 21stC? I thought it was all very weird when it was happening because I was new to the scene and I thought I was choosing obscure bands.

Mr. Greg Kot got some things right in that Rolling Stone article, and some things not so right as far as I know (cough, 21st Century Digital Boy, cough).

http://www.rollingstone.com/art ists/badreligion/biography

"Bad Brains is releasing a new album!?"
their new album is titled Build A Nation, and will be released may 7th. I heard one of the songs on it and pretty bad ass, it sounds very old school. Its also being produced by one of the members of the Beastie Boys.

"How many people here have actually been listening to Bad Religion since pre Stranger Than Fiction days (...)"
Count me in, I got into them during their "holy trinity" era and I became a dedicated listener with the release of Generator, 15 years ago - damn, I'm getting old. My first concert was the WDR Rocknacht in D?sseldorf in 1992, with BR headlining. They opened with the (in)famous Ramones cover "We're A Happy Family" with Brett on lead vocals. Yeah, The Ramones, THE innovators. Do they even appear in this book?
So, I don't know if such a book is necessary, espesially considering the writer's background (Rolling Stone and underground music doesn't mesh well IMO).
But it would be interesting if this book covers some outstanding, yet criminally overlooked underground bands too, like the Doughboys, SNFU, China Drum or the Badtown Boys. I doubt it though.

Rancid and Green Day are legends only when comparing them to modern day corporate punk (an oxymoronic term in itself) bands such as fallout boy, yellowcard and simple plan. They're nothing when compared to Bad Religion's sound of course, but both those bands had enough originality to stand out from the rest of the mid 90's neo punk explosion. Amercan Idiot's a polished version of the same shit Green Day's been putting out for years. They sold out long ago and have come to terms with it, so it's time to let it go. It doesn't mean their BR influenced sound wasn't a catalyst for some to bring about recognition for older, better bands. How many people here have actually been listening to Bad Religion since pre Stranger Than Fiction days without having been reeled into the punk scene by newer bands? I know I haven't, yet here I am proclaiming the superiority of the bands that influenced the very bands that got me into punk in the first place.
Sorry for the long rant, it's been a tough day.

Bad Brains is releasing a new album!?

fuck rancid & green day. Legends? I hate that pretentious bullshit magazines (especially rolling DER) seem to spew on a monthly basis. Op Ivy were legendary, and the only thing legendary about green day is how much they sold out with American Idiot (surprise, i didn't say Dookie).
bleh, bad brains needs to release that album and show these "neo" dumbasses some true shit.

i can't stand fall out boy. there's an article on them, and a really ugly picture on the cover, in every single music magazine every fucking week.
ps this is an exaggeration and is not to be taken literally

Ya, fantasticthepan, it only says that it examines Mall punk.

since when are green day and rancid legends

Umm, Fantasticthepan, where exactly did anyone label Bad Religion as mall punk?

there's nothing mall punk like about bad religion. the only influence br had on this corporatization of punk is that br basically invented to modern socal melodic punk sound and more fashionable types like rancid and green day ran with it. but if you look at br - their clothes are more likely to be found in sears than in hot topic.

The author has been published in Rolling Stone and I bet it's a well-written book. According to our Dr. Greg, Bad Religion is simply reaching a larger audience. Somebody buy it and thereafter post a critique (and sell me their used copy).